MrsP AmbridgeSeptember 29, 2020 at 4:55 PM I wrote and lost two posts about Alice yesterday. I am ambiguous in my sympathy towards Alice, believing that she has brought this problem upon herself and as a basically dishonest and very selfish person she is in a massive quandary about how to solve it. Agree with Stasia, she must know that her foetus will have been affected by her alcohol intake, and she is clearly very frightened by the state she is in. There is only one option open to her and that is to be honest with everybody including herself, but that is also her struggle. She cannot ! But also I agree with the view that the actress is very very good. She has made most of us thoroughly dislike her in creating a very unpleasant and mixed up young woman. Now she is in a predicament that requires sympathy from us, and we have become ambivalent. Good acting and well written.
Miriam - September 29, 2020 at 8:01 PM There has been a virtual Flower + Produce show, so will there be a virtual Christmas Show with Lynda + Susan, arguing who is in control. At least one Ambridge tradition can occur - the Christmas lights around The Green, which can be done socially distanced. It is not even October, why oh why, am I thinking ahead to December..Sorry 🎅
Lanjan - September 29, 2020 at 8:20 PM I presume Alice is paying privately to see the Counsellor . If so I presume she is paying by the hour and will not be having appointments that often. By the time the Counsellor has realised why Alice is so worried it may be too late for her to have an abortion anyway. I agree with Basia she would be far better speaking to a midwife(where is Amy?) or better still go to see her Doctor
Anneveggie - September 29, 2020 at 11:01 PM If Alice would only confess to Chris, they could then both go to the midwife or doctor and find out exactly what the risk to the foetus is. I agree with everyone that the actress playing Alice is doing a good job.
I was under the impression that Alice was consulting with a counsellor from an abortion clinic. Didn’t the counsellor make some remark about decision making? When Pip was pregnant didn’t reluctant Tobe or not Tobe suggest an abortion and it was eventually Tobe a baby called Rosie. Now we have the reverse, an eager I must have a baby, gushing emotional dimwit Chris. And a will she won’t she Alice, have a termination. My recommendation to Alice would be! consider your circumstances, both physically and emotionally and get back to the counsellor PRONTO. If you decide to have a termination then there can’t be much time left.
In this circumstance and moment in TA, I am against an abortion, well at the moment. Alice might not yet feel ready to be pregnant, but Chris is enthusiatic. It is not known yet, how far Alice is in her pregnancy and if the "babe" is affected. I would like to know more, before thinking whether an abortion is the right path to choose. Alice is panicking and in a mindless whirl, but she might adapt to a baby, as it is already a "fait accompli".
Chris is not listening or even taking any notice of Alice’s difficulties in many aspects of her life and behaviour. He lives in some sort of romantic haze and simply can’t recognise the changes in her behaviour. Yes, she can discuss the pregnancy but in the end it it her right to choose. If he is so desperate for a baby he do it The Adam method.
If Chris is such a "dimwit", then how has he his own forge, the farrier work and the extra work of bespoke and individual iron crafts. He has to do his accounts, pay his taxes, etc. Hardly the life of a dimwit.
At least, whatever Alice + Chris decide jointly, after having a scan which has not been mentioned yet, Alice has the offer of a part-time job share with Adam. Joint child-care with Xander?
As I said before my feeling is that Alice will keep the baby but the decision will be taken out of her hands, it'll be too late to terminate and she'll spend her pregnancy fretting on her own. Someone said she forgot to take the pill because of drink, so not a planned pregnancy. She is unable to identify her feelings to herself let alone anyone else. No wonder she feels crowded by flies.
Alice is not the only stupid woman. In future I will check to see if that dreadful stop start -er- when talking ,woman with the most ridiculous laugh is going to be on the programme and I will not listen. I thought I did not like the character of Lilian just because of the bad acting * but now I realise it is also because she is irresponsibly stupid as well.
I agree, one stupid young woman seeking advice from another stupid old woman. Alice knew that Lilian would tell her what she wanted to hear and that was enough to quash her concerns with alcohol.
LanJan I'm with you all the way as far as Lilian is concerned. She has the most disgusting cackle on top of being a very silly, and frequently irresponsible woman. And she is old enough to know better.
I thought Lillian was doing ok until the 🍷 issue even then she said maybe you should check Kate and of course does not know Alice has become alcohol dependent. It maybe a case of her losing their baby ie through falling when drunk and then she will be devastated and realise that she did want it after all and is then told no more will be possible. What a lot they currently are Pip, Kate and Fallon and evening Adam not one of them straight forward on the parent front. Why can’t just one couple get pregnant both be over the moon and enjoy their pending parenthood. Yes I know it wouldn’t be much of a SL but plenty of doom and gloom to even it out I’m sure 🤣 What a joy to see 14 names in the cast list this week 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
So obviously whatever the hospital said to Alice, it wasn't enough to bring home the reality of her drinking! As the medical books say there is no safe level of alcohol during pregnancy! As Alice doesn't realise she is an alcoholic she will carry on regardless and then demand answers when they discover the baby is brain damaged and looks different. Lilian is hardly the best role model for motherhood, or anything else come to that. Pity, she was such a nice young girl!
Perhaps but don't forget she has got all her money from marrying or living with very rich men! She did have the sense though not to let Justin 'take over' Amside residentials or whatever the official title is!
I agree that Chris is not a ‘dimwit’ when it comes to his work life, having qualified to become a farrier and built up his own successful business. (And become his mother’s pride and joy!)
But he is definitely a dimwit when it come to Alice and personal relations. As I said once before, he just doesn’t have any empathy, can’t ‘read’ her at all. He is so besotted with her that he can’t see beyond the fact he’s going to be a father and possibly, worst of all, just doesn’t listen to what she is trying to tell him. He needs to be able to read between the lines where Alice is concerned.
And as for Lilian and her very outdated view of what you can and can’t do when pregnant - words fail me. She may be kindhearted, have been a good friend Lynda and is ‘only trying to help’ but she is just about the most irritating character in TA for me, and like Lanjan, I feel like switching off when she is in the day’s cast list. It’s that dirty, suggestive laugh. And the fact that she sounds permanently semi-drunk!
Whatever we think of Lilian, she did leave Alice feeling a bit more positive about her pregnancy. Modern thinking is no drinking during pregnancy but an occasional one IMHO does no harm. The danger for Alice though is that if she is an alcoholic as it seems, it won’t stop at one drink. We shall see!
When Alice told Chris, he did ask how she felt about it so not quite as dim as thought. The trouble is that he has Alice up on a pedestal and in his eyes she can do no wrong.
Emma spelt it out loud for them "alcoholic" but neither took a blind bit of notice! So they are both dim. As for Lilian, I Iike her and her acting and she is stupid.
Alice is only feeling more positive about her pregnancy because Lilian told her it was okay to drink!
I suspect the hospital told her 'No drink' and she had apparently taken notice of that. The other thing that Lilian said was that she could still have a good time after the baby is born. Alice's idea of a good time is to party and get drunk. That's alright for someone like Lilian who had a live-in nanny for James but the Carters finances won't run to that! Ordinary people, who can't afford a full time nanny, find that a child makes a profound difference to their lives!
If Alice now believes it is OK for her to continue drinking then we will face a s/l about alcohol syndrome babies. It's hard to see any other outcome unless someone, maybe Emma, makes sure Alice does not drink throughout her pregnancy. Lilian is using outdated information and is an old soak anyway and probably could never imagine surviving without alcohol.
Well we can't have Alice having a perfect baby or everyone will think that it is fine to drink as much alcohol as one likes when pregnant. Two alternatives are that she decides to have an abortion or sadly the baby is born malformed in some way. In fairness I can't see the latter happening. I hope not anyway. Lilian, Chris,Emma would all feel so guilty. Alice would be suicidal. Do we want that? I don't. I think the only answer is for her to have a miscarriage . Sad but better than other alternatives.
Why can't we have a nice little storyline where pleasant things happen ?
I suspect she will have a miscarriage as soon as she comes to accept the idea of having a baby. However that is repeating Kirsty's story of a couple of years ago! OR she continues with the pregnancy and despite everything the baby is fine. But this means another 6-8 months of this angst. Will there be any listeners left then? As you say that is not helpful advice (to drink, drink, drink) if the SWs want to follow this issue! Lilian is a terrible influence on young people. Look at what a horror she has raised in James! Not a very nice person at all.
Thinking further about it, Spicy is right and Alice as she is will make a rubbish mother. She needs time if she is to mature and grow into her present age which must be about 32! Like Pip though she does have family around to palm the baby off on while she goes clubbing or does her own thing! Yes, agree the best outcome would be a miscarriage. The other scenario, maybe abortion without telling Chris and then he may wake up to the fact that she has feet of clay! I’m sorry, but I quite like Lilian!😉
I actually like Lilian. She is a character, can be very kind-hearted, astute but as an advisor on Alice's pregnancy, she doesn't know the facts. If she did, would she have done what she did? As for the "cackle" isn't it better to laugh than cry?
Don't forget Gavin, he knows that Alice drinks, he found her when she passed out and shouldn't be fooled into thinking that it was a one off. Will he influence her or insinuate to Chris? Gavin has acquired a lot of life's experience all of a sudden.
He has secrets being kept well hidden, which he would not like to me made public. On that basis only, will he tell about Alice's demise, which is her secret..and both involve others, such as Chris + "babe", plus the workers, particularly Blake.
Miriam. “Alice’s demise”? Do you and Gavin know something we don’t? Well, now that Lillian has given her permission to drink and have a good, she and said baby might just head for oblivion.
Is the S/L going to be Alice dead and Chris left holding a damaged baby? Quite frankly my dear, I don’t give a hoot.
Hee, hee ! A horribly plausible SL, Stasia, but TA don't often let the young die young, do they, except by a terrible accident ? ?They've let this alcohol issue drag on for at least 2 years, as in real life, indeed, they often do, so they ain't going to wind it up with a hastily contrived death, be it mother or foetus or both. Confession : haven't been listening at all, but going by comments here a) am glad Lynda has reverted to the ridiculously pretentious & bossy character we liked to dislike, so we don't feel so drawn to feel sorry for her any more b) am glad to miss out on Alice's decline into a car crash, whilst family & husband look on in gormless puzzlement.
I wonder if we haven't been given a long piece of string by the SWs. I picked up a clue from this evenings episode that perhaps the real story line is going to be the social phenomenon of young woman not wanting to have children at all, and the consequence being a falling birth rate. Alice has been adamant over the years that she was not ready to have a baby and is now struggling with her emotions because she is pregnant and her perception that she will lose her autonomy. Fallon this evening has now told her mother that she does not want children, and now understands that she needs, quite rightly to discuss this with her partner. Alice of course has never discussed the subject with Christopher because Alice has a number of problems connected to understanding the concept of truth. She lies ! And of course she has been and still is lying to herself. Fallon being a person of integrity has thought it through.
I wondered that too MrsP. Have they (the TA team) decided to take on a global issue?It seems strange that after babies galore, possibly one every year, suddenly we have two women, two nights running, declaring they did not/do not want any children. One because she is afraid that a baby will divert attention away from her and one saying it is for the good of the planet!
Yes, me too. I thought of Spike Milligan years ago, saying how much he regretted having children - he loved them but it was bad for the planet. He was an environmentalist before the word was invented. I agree that our planet needs fewer humans. David Attenborough has said that we have over-run the planet, so I believe that a falling birth-rate is a Very Good Thing.
I don’t welcome this as a storyline but have to say I sympathise with any woman who doesn’t want children (and there are more of us than you might imagine). I have always been thankful that I live in an age when it is not incumbent on a woman to have children and the means to avoid having them exists. I have never understood why not wanting children for oneself is called ‘selfish’ but wanting children for oneself isn’t.
In terms of TA, both women should have levelled with their partners beforehand. And if. this is partly about out overcrowded and endangered planet, maybe the scriptwriters saw the Old Vic’s recent Zoom performance of Lungs, in which Netflix stars in The Crown, Matt Smith and Clare Foy, starred as a young couple agonising over having children for precisely that reason.
Well if the reason for taking on this story line is to make us aware that the planet is overloaded with people then they have chosen the wrong programme to do it. I would imagine that most of the listeners are past childbearing age..
To be fair, LanJan that would rule out most of TA’s storylines in that the majority of listeners are not (and possibly never were) in the same position as the characters involved - but it doesn’t stop them being interested in other people’s dilemmas.
Chris, Jacob and Harrison all want babies. Maybe they could all request womb transplants? I suspect they will all be given one by said partners, Who will promptly forget and just like Toby become the wonder parent of the year. Although I don’t know where Jacob will get his now that Kate is infertile.
I am not sure that I agree with you on that one Maryellen .9:22am. Listeners may or may not be interested in other people's dilemmas and if they are then there are programmes about those subjects. I don't think it is the job of the editor of The Archers to make us aware of various problems from which folk may be suffering . Let us have a bit of escapism
We do get the escapism, mostly the Snells now Lilian has sorted their marriage problem for them, you could hardly call them true to life! But the Archers was never meant to be a fairy tale, and is never more respected than when it handles real life themes well.
Did the couples not discuss whether or not they wanted children before marriage? I think if a man wants children, and would make a good father, and the woman decides after marriage she doesn't then that isn't being fair on the man, and she should offer him a divorce so that he can marry someone else. That works both ways of course. I know someone who married a man who said before marriage he didn't want children, and she has endured much anguish down the years because she very much wanted a child, but fair dos to him he did make that clear before marriage.
Why the heck she didn't just accidentally on purpose forget to take the pill I don't know. I think a child brings its love with it, and personally I think there is nothing more wonderful than creating a new life. Re. Fallon : if thinking intelligent people decide not to have children then the world will end up being filled with, no doubt nice but, unintelligent people who won't have the ability to solve the world's problems.
Can't see that any of the intelligent minus/plus nice, or nice minus/plus intelligent people, ihave made any headway in solving the world's problems thus far !
Maryellen,I thought that Lilian had no right to try to sort out Lynda and Robert's marital problems . They would have got them sorted out without her in time..Interfering old biddy. Why on earth did we all need to know about it anyway?
Before we married, Mike said he didn’t want more children already having two from his first marriage. In due course he saw it wasn’t fair on me especially as the two stepdaughters came to live with us. We had Katy and then when she was 3, I felt strongly that I wanted another child. He was adamant that as far as he was concerned that was it. Yes, I thought of accidentally on purpose forgetting the pill but I had to think that he would have resented it and his relationship with the child and with me would have suffered. I think that if he had continued not to want another child, I would very regretfully have walked away as again I could foresee the problems Janice’s friend had to suffer. I agree with Jolene that the urge to become a grandmother is low on the list of priorities when compared with the happiness of her daughter.
....if he had continued not to want another child before we married in addition to the two he had! I accepted the pre marriage agreement that a fourth was not on the cards in due course but it wasn’t easy! No regrets now.
It doesn't seem to me that the choice on whether or not to have children is a matter of right or wrong intrinsically
I do find it mildly irritating that Fallon has to be given an altruistic reason for not wanting to have a child. So PC, so TA. What about couples who don't have children because it doesn't fit with how they live their lives ? Absolutely & categorically nothing wrong about that ! Just a mature & realistic decision. I've known a number of people like that, & very well rounded people they are ( who don't, incidently, dislike children at all, in fact, enjoy being aunts, uncles, real or surrogate, to others' children)
On the other hand, there is something dodgy about those who see parenthood as some kind of 'right'. Thinking of Helen, of course, who, without a partner, chose to have Henry by means of donor sperm, with no consideration of how a person born that way might have problems, perhaps as a child, & more than likely, as an adult
Recent research concludes that donor children/adults have similar health and well-being to the general population, so Henry should be okay on that account. Helen was probably advised that was the case.
Before we married Mr S appeared to agree to my request that there should be no children - other members of my family had done a more than adequate job of going forth and multiplying and I had been helping to bring up children from the age of 10. Unfortunately I had married an arch goal-post mover, and after the first year he said he assumed I didn't really mean it and it was my duty as his wife to have children.
However, once I had complied he didn't seem all that keen on the result and the upshot is that as his widow I have a son and daughter in their forties dedicated to my well being!
Freddie is going to direct the Christmas show? Did he obtain his thespian 🎭 experience whilst enjoying doing time at Her Majesty’s leisure. Then we have the stupid naughty milkman delivering alcohol to ??. Don’t normal people go to the supermarket or off licence. Perhaps a specialist wine seller. I’ll bet Lillian and Justin don’t drink The Bulls plonk. Fallon doesn’t want babies, so what. It’s her body, her choice. Her disinclination to procreate isn’t about saving the world. Is she intelligent? How do we know? She married a wooden sounding top so what does that say about her intelligent decision making. It is all rubbish what about the unsolved stories?
In my view, Fallon + Harrison, are the ideal couple, to have a new Ambridge "Babe", born to loving parents, with no hang-ups. The latest sprogs:- Rosie from a quick liasion between Pip + Toby, Xander a surrogate babe, Jack from a "rape", all of whom are well loved regardless, and now there is Alice and her conditions and quandrary, abortion or not? I just wish for a normal pregnancy, from a lovely Ambridge couple. Who was the last - Keira??
When I was young I did not want to have children. I didn't want to get married either. I did want to choose how I lived my life alone. I became pregnant, even though taking precautions available at the time and had an abortion. Some years later when in a relationship I became pregnant again and unwilling to have another abortion I married and in due course had two daughters. Circumstances were such that my life as a wife and mother lasted for one single decade. I realise that the above scenario is not the case for all, but here fifty odd years later I still wish that I could go back and do it all again and stick to my wish and not have children, or to be married. I did feel as Fallon has claimed that the world is overpopulated and still feel the same, but that was not my only reason. I did not want to be encumbered by children, and in my case I do know that having made the choice to go ahead and have children and to do so willingly, with good will and intention to give it 100%, and having done so, I still feel that I would have gone without. Motherhood was good and I enjoyed it, but it lasted a very short time for me. And no, I do not feel it has been worth it.
I agree wholeheartedly with Carolyn, it is a matter of choice to have or not have children with no right or wrong attached to that choice. But to those who feel it is a ' right' and not a privilege I give no sympathy, and still view IVF and all that science has allowed since to be fundamentally wrong.
Sadly some couples, desparate for a child, cannot conceive naturally. I have no objection to IVF but I am against abortion, unless there is a necessary medical intervention. An unwanted child, which is then given up and then adopted, would fill the void, felt by so many couples.
An old- fashioned view perhaps, but it is still relevant today, for many. As I have said before, these are just my own thoughts + ideals, which are different from others, I know.
Unwanted children are not always given up for adoption, Miriam. Many, if not most, are left to be brought up by resentful mothers who have no interest in them. I know, I've taught some of them, for whose well-being it might have been better had they never been born.
I have not joined in this discussion so far as I have little new to add. When I married we assumed we would have children and were blessed with a daughter and son. I enjoyed being a stay at home Mum far more than I would have been pursuing a career. Perhaps it was my Jewish upbringing that places such high importance on family and I wanted to be as good a mother to my children as mine had been to me. I hope I succeeded.
But I don’t think it is a ‘right’ for a woman to have a child. I am ambivalent about IVF for happily married couples, but I very much disagree with the course taken by Helen. Deliberately bringing a child into the world without a father present seems like a very self-indulgent act. Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I am still old-fashioned enough to think that a child thrives best with, ideally, a mother and father present in their lives.
I think a couple should talk this important matter over - whether or not to have children - well before marriage. It is the most important decision one can make after all. You can get out of a marriage but you can't get out of parenthood and it is lifelong. Deciding not to procreate is a valid choice and should not be called 'selfish'. It is not selfish as our planet is over-populated. Certainly no-one should put pressure on anyone to provide grandchildren, that IMHO is selfish.
I knew a woman for a few years who told me that she married and had children in order to become a grandmother. I thought that very strange indeed. At the time I knew her she wasn't yet a grandmother.
Caroline 1.55. I think science has made some headway, albeit slowly. A lot of diseases have been wiped out by medicines, think antibiotics, plus the provision of clean water supplies, women no longer have to exhaust themselves having 14 plus children because effective contraception is now available, people like Elon Musk are throwing their energy into space travel and colonisation ( which I think will have to happen if we are to survive in the long term). So I do think intelligent thinking people are making progress and are essential to our longterm progress. I think there is a problem in that these things are not shared out equally around the world. My son was puzzled to see far more people in the Philippines with missing limbs than in Britain, and has realised that this is often because people do not have access to/cannot afford diabetic medication.
You are right Janice. I believe diabetes is almost endemic in some of the Pacific Islands (Figi, Tonga for example) mainly because if the sugar-laden food parcels that were gifted to them from the USA during or after the last war. They have become addicted to high sugar foods. It is almost unusual NOT to have the condition and it’s side effects on some islands. But, I digress, and this has nothing to do with TA.....apologies
Archerphile. I don’t wish to be a killjoy but you are right all this talk of babies wanted or unwanted has deviated from the Archers S/L. Perhaps the conversation would, as you suggest be moved to the other blog. Thanks.
I am looking forward to tomorrows omnibus edition of TA. I enjoy the continuity and picking up on salient points, I missed in the weekly, nightly, episodes. There are always quite a few!
It will be listening to TA at 10.00am with extreme interest, whilst cleaning the kitchen, where I am now making a mess, cooking R.Lamb and all the extras. TA will help me take my mind off this chore. 😆
I wonder if they are planning a long term story about Foetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder? As I'm sure I'm sure the issue of early developmental trauma will crop up again in the future as Helen's oldest (whose name I've forgotten!) moves up through school and struggles to cope socially. He's already seen as a little bit difficult, isn't he?
FASD is a life long disability which generally isn't visible. The physical symptoms are apparently only apparent if the mother is drinking on days 19, 20 and 21 of the pregnancy. Brain development effects aren't visible. A reluctant mum who is drinking regularly and sometimes binging, but holding down a job pretty much ok, and a child with a compromised ability to manage decision-making and impulse control doesn't bode well. Nut lots of good story lines!
Interesting information regarding FASD Jules, I don’t think we’ve been told yet how many weeks along she is, since it was the result of forgetting to take her contraceptive pill she probably doesn’t know either. The physical symptoms are relatively subtle so presumably would not be easily spotted on an early scan, although careful measurement might show some abnormality if the mother expressed concerns. We certainly know that Alice was was drinking pretty heavily.
I am also intrigued as to how pregnant Alice is. She doesn't seem to be in a rush, about booking in with her GP. and a midwife, to arrange her care + book scans.
KP I think if it was me, I would write your last sentence as:- "drinking very heavily"... 😁
So Alice now thinks that drinking red wine, will boost her iron levels - thanks to Lilian! Sadly it is the opposite..red wine can prevent the absorption of iron, from a normal diet. Lilian's advice was so out-of-date and will do no good for Alice, IMHO, but could be wrong.
I know many do not like me guessing future S/Ls, but I just have to do this one. It is Alice drinks too much, yet again, has an "accident" of some sort, rushed to hospital but all is OK. This is when she realises, that she does want her baby...so it ends up, as the fairy tales say - Happily Ever After - and Baby Carter arrives safely, sometime in 2021.
Thank you JULES for the further information on FASD. We have wondered earlier in this thread or on the last blog whether or not this was the intention of TA. It's good to have the understanding and details that you have provided. Perhaps you are a doctor ?
The effects of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome vary from one child to another. There can be some physical repercussions but they are mainly behavioural and psychological. These children have poor attention and short ability to concentrate. Many of the behavioural aspects are similar to those described in autism. It is a syndrome, so some children might have severe debilitating affects and others very little. The current medical thinking is for a pregnant woman to abstain during the pregnancy, however the evidence on what might be a safe amount to consume is not there. Hence the advice is don’t drink. Alice doesn’t know the time frame for getting pregnant. We know it is at least a few weeks. She only knows because of the hospital test. Many women may drink alcohol up to the point of a positive test and stop. If she accepts Lillian’s advice then she could be putting the foetus at risk.
Johnny bought some because Joy told him he'd get lucky and then inadvertently threw them in the bin on the Green and realised too late he might have won. Daisy, Harrison's niece found one, Fallon wanted to keep it but he was going to advertise in the shop. Now it's lost again...
I said I wanted to know what happened to the scratch card and it wasn't forgotten, I reckon it'll still turn up. Jill and Ben had this conversation before, when he made it home after his 18th night out. She said that she went out for cream tea but his experience was somewhat different. I certainly don't want surprises, even though I'm younger than Jill, too many in the last 15 years. When young we make things happen and then it's a case of be careful what you wish for.
They keep repeating before each episode that it was recorded before the current restrictions which are?
Fantastic! It’s the TA storyline I’ve always wanted! Buried treasure, archeologicalists uncover an important archeological site, putting Ambridge on the world archeology map and drawing so many visitors, they have to create a visitor’s centre an museum, where Lynda is in her element. Fallon enlarges her catering business. Most importantly, it brings in new and interesting characters.🙂
Or it might just be a handful of Victorian pennies, dropped from some old Archer’s pocket.🙁
I remember you suggesting this storyline a long time ago Maryellen. I think it was when there were a lot of archaeological digs on television and it was a very popular interest. I think I also suggested that they could invite Carenza Lewis to make an appearance as a famous expert to come and investigate what had been found in Ambridge. Maybe, at long last, your excellent suggestion is going to come to pass!
Lovely scenario Maryellen and straight from the fifties, where of course TA started.
I was very confused by this evenings episode. Thank you Basia, I thought it was me having deja vu on hearing of the eighteenth birthday cream tea. And the conversation between Alice and Fallon seemed bizarre given Alice's recent confusion extended over what felt like three weeks of episodes. Now she appears to have accepted that she is to have a baby and seemed to me to be pretending that she and Chris had discussed and decided together. It didn't seem to me to be a seamless blend in the process of acceptance, if that is what we are supposed to understand it is. What happened in between these two scenarios ?
If she was so dependant on alcohol up until her ‘accident’ it’s not going to be that easy to just give up, is it? Wouldn’t she be getting some sort of withdrawal symptoms if she has suddenly stopped drinking? This is a genuine question because I have no experience of alcoholism or what happens when someone is trying to stop.
As an original member of the ‘Jill Fan Club’ I was relieved to hear her again last night, for the first time since lockdown began. But even I have to say, her acting came over as a bit desperate. Rushed, too much emphasis on the wrong words, not very natural at all. Well done Paddy Greene for making the effort, but she probably finds it difficult to cope reading the script with her eye problem and having to act at sitting 2 metres away from the other actors.
I very much regret to say, perhaps it is time for Jill to retire to a distant cottage with her Leonard and let the younger generation have full reign at Brookfield.
I was hoping to hear of Jill but not Jill herself because I find her trying to listen to. I agree the actor should take the current situation as a hint it’s time to retire and leave the airwaves to younger actors more in need of the work. And Yes, the same goes for the other older actors.
I still think Jill sounded more natural than Ben/Josh not sure which! Very wooden 'script-reading' by the young man. I don't necessarily think that the younger actors are more "in the need of the work" though. Even though Paddy Greene is 89 and will be getting a pension I don't suppose she has accumulated great wealth as an actor. Certainly not from BBC radio! Add to that the fact she is is only paid on the scripts in which she takes part, there is no 'central contract.' TA did have some archaeology finds some years ago if I remember correctly. Something to do with the Civil War as there was supposed to have been a battlefield in the area. And of course the 'Drummer Boy' ghost at The Bull was I think connected to the Civil War too.
My book says there are Bronze Age burial mounds on Lakey Hill and evidence of a Bronze Age settlement at Long Ground, a field near Hollowtree Pig Unit, also of a Roman farmstead at Jiggins Field which was partly excavated in the mid-70s.
I have seen references to the Jill actor’s big house, which suggests she is not on the breadline, while the Kirsty actor is bringing up a family in a 2 bedroom flat. The severe lack of work makes this a tough time for actors in mid career- time for those at the end of theirs (past it, in some cases) to do the decent thing.
I agree with you about Jill ,Archerphile and Maryellen. I don't know where Leonard lives but think she should go and move in with him and be heard about but not actually heard as you say Maryellen. I still don't know why they can't get Carole to go and live with her daughter so that Jill can sell her cottage or why they don't get Kathy to move to be with Jamie. I bet the present script writers haven't a clue who Jamie is anyway.
Idon't agree about Peggy though I think the actress playing her is still good .
I agree with you ,Spicycushion that Ben sounded wooden. I have only just started to listen again (I am doing the washing up now - at 2pm and 7pm ) I won't be listening again to last night's episode when I wash up after lunch today.
I think there’s more than merit affecting an actor’s employability - reliability, flexibility, availability etc. The arbiters there would be the casting director and the actor’ agent. Whether the actors themselves need the job for financial reasons or want the job for professional self esteem is an individual thing.
Maryellen - I really like your s/l suggestions. This would be an upbeat s/l which is much needed with all the financial doom and gloom going on. Plus the 'joys' of hearing about alcohol abuse and human beings called 'horses' etc. Let's have some escapist pleasure.
What I couldn't fathom out last night, was the missing scratch card and it's sudden relevance.
I liked hearing Jill again, but I thought she was recording remotely and not in the studio. I also think that Carole T should up and leave Glebe Cottage, which Jill could sell. It would "snapped up" by new Ambridge residents, which the Hills certainly, aren't!
To add - I don't think Jill will ever move out of Brookfield, nor will she ever marry Leonard. They are just companions, enjoying very many times together, being so like minded.
I’m standing up for Carol who I like a lot. Why should she have to move out of Glebe Cottage just to suit the whims of listeners who don’t even live in Ambridge? Jill doesn’t want to leave Brookfield and clearly doesn’t need to sell, she’s okay with the income from the rent and enjoys having her long time friend there. It’s not for us to interfere!
The characters in T A are frequently silenced, so there should no problem putting Jill back into her box. Ben should go away and be a proper student at university. I do hope he is ‘reading’ drama with acting.
I can understand that old coins may be found using a metal detector but the chance of a couple of them lying on the surface of the field I would think would be pretty remote. I am not going to be listening again but I can't remember whether it was eagle eyed Jill or Ben who noticed them. Why haven't the burial mounds on Lakey Hill been excavated? I know when some of us were making up future episodes * mention was made about finding old coins in a field some years ago it was when the Grundy's were on their uppers and we were hoping that it would be Ed who found the treasure. Whose land were Jill and Ben on?
* The first alternative script I think was written by Ellie May. It was great . She had Rob jumping over a fence on his horse and breaking his neck. What a lot of angst we would have avoided had that happened!
Lanjan. With so many S/ls being dragged out at the moment do we need The Ambridge Hoard? All us oldies might lose the plot or become The Ambridge Bored? Miriam is the exception of course. 😉
As I am now an official State Pensioner, I also lose the plot - which is quite often, hence my listening to the TA omnibus on a Sunday, to catch up, on what I missed, nightly. 🤣😂
Well Stasia,I certainly don't. Let us concentrate on Phillip and Gavin. When Ptb Y and I said that we didn't trust them I think some people thought we were being Welshist . I can't speak for P tbY but then I don't like Natasha either.! I am not Welshist though. I once had a lovely Welsh boyfriend.
The scriptwriters are on a sticky wicket now. If they allow Alice to have a perfectly healthy baby now after the amount of alcohol she has consumed it will send out the message that it is perfectly OK to drink a large amount of alcohol when pregnant. As I said on an earlier blog I think the only way out for them is for Alice to have a miscarriage.
Alice is trying to persuade herself that if it hasn't happened to other drinking mothers it won't happen to her. I'm still sticking to my prediction that she will go through it but the whole process will be harrowing and she might end up a wreck not the baby which is not in anybody's interest.
At the moment Chris is as bad, for different reasons, as Rob was, when their respective wives became pregnant. Sadly there the similarity ends as Chris and Alice love one another and are still 'in love' I would say. Of course poor Helen (never thought I'd call her that!) was raped by her husband which resulted in an unwanted pregnancy. However when the pregnacy was confirmed both men took over, answering the midwife's questions and asserting what the woman has done or not done. I hope that the midwife picked up on Alice's hesitation at times and follows it up. Now we know that Alice is exactly 12 weeks pregnant she still has a bit of time to change her mind about going ahead with the pregnancy. But like Lanjan I think she will have a miscarriage because of the implications of the message being sent out about alcohol during pregnancy. The other annoying thing is the fact that the SWs have Alice stopping drinking excessively just like that! If she was drinking as heavily as hinted at and portrayed she would be getting withdrawal symptons. And she was /is an alcoholic; some days drinking vodka at breakfast time! But no she is healthy, well balanced and whose appearance gives no concern to those who see her. Unrealistic I'm afraid!
My prediction about interesting new characters is already on the way to being fulfilled forget uninspiring Alice, there’s archeology student Evie on the horizon!
The storylines have not been good for a while . Is Elizabeth on a dating site or have a imagined that? I didn't listen except for the first few episodes when the monologues started. If so,I bet she goes for someone younger.
I wonder if the Alice’s scan will show up some abnormality, not necessarily alcohol related, so she has a “valid” reason to opt for a termination. She and Chris could then decide whether they do want to start a family, and if so Alice will have the opportunity to get help with her alcohol addiction prior to trying to conceive a second time. The midwife didn’t really emphasise the point, but the first few weeks of pregnancy are when alcohol is most dangerous, unless a couple are consciously trying to conceive the woman may easily overindulge in that period.
If the midwife did pick up on Alice's hesitation, and even if not, she could, and perhaps should, access Alice's notes from the hospital from the recent ' feint' as Alice called it. It wasn't a feint, she collapsed. When Gavin found her he picked up the sight of her on the verge with his lights. She must have been there for more than a few seconds.
The hospital notes would also have recorded that Alice high levels of blood alcohol, remember Gavin smelt it on her and the medics would have too. Alice is getting closer to admitting her drinking to Chris, so maybe she can get a grip and sort herself out.
😂 BUT I think there is a geography teacher among us , so perhaps there needs to be a quick poetic addition saying that some teachers have a genuine vocation and are truly inspiring.
I do apologise to our resident geography teacher. I’m sure you are/were excellent. On seconds thoughts he could be the next PM several years down the line. At least one ex PM did geography. Maybe it fits better with politics. Mea culpa.
Anyone who watches Doctors, the lunchtime soap on BBC (or did before Covid stopped filming) might be interested to know that Alice’s midwife is played by one of their actresses. Nurse Ayesha, who left the practice at the end of the last series has now swopped to radio to play another nurse/midwife. I thought her voice was familia last night but couldn’t quite place it. So for this actress, one for closed and another opened.
I,too, knew the voice but couldn't place it! That's three of the female staff at Letherbridge have briefly appeared in TA; Mrs Tembe (something to do with LoLo for one night only), Ruhma who was Elizabeth's counsellor and now Nurse Ayesha (who I never really took too as she could be very stroppy!) And of course from TA we have had Leonard and Oliver make 'guest' appearances in Doctors!
I have finally found out, who did play Elizabeth's counsellor. It was Lorna Laidlaw, the wonderful Mrs. Tembe. She was called Jamilla and there was a wonderful episode (13/2/2019) which was the face to face, counselling session. The only characters in this episode, were Elizabeth + Jamilla. I remember it, as being just a wonderful episode, with sad overtones, relating to Nigel.
Spicy, I totally agree with ups about Ayesha, never took to her from her first day. Jolly relived when she left! Wonder when it will be back? (Sorry, another digression from TA)
Didn't Doctors have an episode, relating to a child who had FAS, so highliting it, as TA is now attempting to do. Think this should also be on the other page.
Bharti Patel played Geraldine the assistant manager at LoLo, who resigned when Elizabeth was letting things slide whilst preoccupied with Freddie's impending court case and imprisonment. As Miriam says she had previously played Anita the woman on the help line that Helen had rung after Rob had confiscated her car keys. Lorna Laidlaw's appearance as Elizabeth's counsellor came on the same day as her last appearance on Doctors. Phew! Glad we managed to sort that out in my head. I'm a bit of a pedant I'm afraid! 😁
Archerphile - I wouldn't worry about the occasional slip up about which blog to write a comment. Your previous comment was quite understandable following on as it did about whether to have children or not which was the main story-line last week! I have now taken to copying my comments before 'publish' as I keep getting message 'whoops .... ' etc!
I heard on the radio today about a new law to be voted on tomorrow in France to extend the lawful termination from 12 to 14 weeks, then checked that in the UK it's 24.
I think it comes partially down to religion. I have to tread carefully here, but the major faith in these two countries are different, which can influence such rulings, such as contraception.
Did Chis and Alice actually go to see the midwife or was it all done by phone? it wasn't realistic to me either way. I thought the actress playing the midwife sounded as if she was reading prepared notes.
I understood it to be by zoom or phone, or some such technology. However I did note that Alice regretted that it wasn't Face to face. Alice, let me tell you something. If you had been face to face with the midwife, she would most definitely have picked up the slight give away when you hesitated before you lied about your drinking.
I think the midwife knows, as a result of Alice's hospital visit. Hence the questions re alcohol and the mentioning of constant urine + blood tests. I have done a lot of research on Fetal Acohol Syndrome and as expected, the first trimester is the most dangerous period. Alice has only just learnt that she is already 3 months into her pregnancy. In the past 3 months, she was drinking heavily, but hiding it. I am sure if she tells the truth to both Chris and her midwife, she can get the help she so needs. I hope she has been frightened into doing this.
I realise that this is not the right place, but it is a follow on from previous thoughts. To post on the other board, would be out of place, at this time. I have no experience of FAS in my previous work, but I do have experience of new borns, with a problem. This relates to a foster parent, a regular client of mine, who specialised in caring for new babes, born from Mums with a drug problem. These newborns, were born "addicted" and had to go through withdrawal symptoms after the birth. This is where I came in, supplying the needed meds for these, and as a result, I got to see the progress, the care that was needed and how social services helped. I hope Alice's situation, does not end up in a similar way - but I think not. She has to tell all, now.
All about the money found by chance. I said the scratch card would turn up. It must have been when Fallon was dressing up Jazzer for the photo shoot, now it will find its way back to Johnny.
Miriam that must have been very rewarding to see those addicted babies recover. I do hope that most of them did, although I realise that some must not do so.
The S/Ws need to see the “bigger picture”. Not just Ruth. Now we have the game of Pass the Scratch Card! Plus a gaggle of archeology “girls” shipped in to satisfy testosterone fuelled Ambridge ‘boys’. Perhaps the next S/Ws ‘brain storming’ session, on what next in T A, should include actors who can act.
Ooo yes, Stasia. Just been watching an interview on BBC Breakfast with a woman who fell prey to that. Lost over £53,000, her entire savings to an online ‘Romance scammer’ The thief pretended be in the Royal Navy and groomed her for months before pleading with money for medical treatment for someone stuck abroad. Could Elizabeth be duped like that? A possibility?
Regarding the new archeology storyline ....I think the SWs have been reading this blog and thought Maryellen's idea was great, and something a bit different to the usual fare. Hence introducing the Angolan-Saxon coins and a whole host of possibilities. Well done, Maryellen. 😊
Katy said the archaeology story was flawed as with Covid restrictions it is not even allowed to put students in a coach together. Professional archaeologists are back at work but obviously having to stick to the social distancing rules. Maybe the wrong time for this SL!
That’s interesting Ev, I did wonder listening to Ben. He would seem to be experiencing student differently to those currently at university. Would a first year, first term student really be able to rustle up an archeological dept at such short notice? Mary Ellen’s prediction would be a good storyline to project. But I suspect to make it dramatic it will have to involve an issue. I hope the Grundy will be down there with their metal detector claiming first dabs. Of course they will have to share with David and Ruth and the dept of Antiquities.
Absolutely the right timing for this storyline as far as I’m concerned because I was beginning to feel like LanJan that the other current storylines make dire listening. The continuity announcers are careful to point out that the storylines were conceived and recorded BEFORE current Covid-19 restrictions were in place. I have every confidence that Felmersham University will do the right thing by its students and their contacts.
Correction. Student life. The Grundy’s. Didn’t Ruth say that Eddie had been in that field with his metal doctor and found nothing. So presumably he was given permission at some point to explore?
Apologies to any residents of Felmersham reading my previous post who may be surprised to find they have a university - it should of course read Felpersham!
maryellen. You will be pleased to know that Felmersham does exist and could possibly have a university! Perhaps of the Third Age, with resident archaeologists. Having been on dig myself it was the official county archaeologists who conducted the exploration. They were persuaded by a farmer that the land had bee a roman site. They did find Anglo Saxon bits and pieces. Of course the news will leak, as things do in Ambridge and the hoard may well be robbed. A job for the local Sargent. My imagination is doing overtime. Apologies.
I am intrigued, as you all know, about the scratch card, which has now turned up in Jazzer's washing! Who can now prove who owns it.... Enter Sgt. Burns - his big case, at last, to solve.
This is better than a game of "Cludeo", which I love and always win, so much so that no-one will play it with me. 😢
Famous last words Jennifer! I was right the scratch card got lost when Fallon dressed up Jazzer for the photo shoot. I won't rest though until it's in Johnny's hands. Webster might have mangled it!
Jennifer said, somethg like, how anxious she was with the Lexi pregnancy, remarking on how well Xander is. She has no idea what her daughter has been up to.. I just hope her happy tears, will not be reproduced....in any other way.
I thought Susan was very good with Jennifer. I wonder why Alice didn’t text her mother to find out when she would be at home before going to impart the news. Perhaps she doesn’t feel up to it, yet and hasn’t tried.
Maryellen, I thought Susan made a brilliant job of a very sticky situation with Jennifer. Emollient to the last. She's a clever cookie is Susan when she thinks her way through a problem And Jenny perhaps at last coming closer to accepting the fact that she "is related to a Horribin"
Not just related Jennifer, but sharing grandmother responsibilities with a Horribin. ( if your daughter is lucky enough to give birth to a live full term baby )
I agree with others that Susan behaved very well with Jennifer's outburst. She smoothed the waters and made an ally of Jennifer. We can only hope that this s/l will have a happy ending.
I remember Susan being equally good with Lynda when she was in a state about something, one of her shows I think, and I’ll never forget the calm and competent way in which - at a moment’s notice and.working against the clock - Susan altered one of Christopher’s jackets to go with Jazzer’s best man’s outfit.
Susan also organised Williams's childcare. What I thought last night though, was that this was Charlotte Martin in her professional role rather than Susan.
*** FROM PREVIOUS BLOG ***
ReplyDeleteMrsP AmbridgeSeptember 29, 2020 at 4:55 PM
I wrote and lost two posts about Alice yesterday.
I am ambiguous in my sympathy towards Alice, believing that she has brought this problem upon herself and as a basically dishonest and very selfish person she is in a massive quandary about how to solve it.
Agree with Stasia, she must know that her foetus will have been affected by her alcohol intake, and she is clearly very frightened by the state she is in.
There is only one option open to her and that is to be honest with everybody including herself, but that is also her struggle.
She cannot !
But also I agree with the view that the actress is very very good.
She has made most of us thoroughly dislike her in creating a very unpleasant and mixed up young woman. Now she is in a predicament that requires sympathy from us, and we have become ambivalent.
Good acting and well written.
Miriam - September 29, 2020 at 8:01 PM
There has been a virtual Flower + Produce show, so will there be a virtual Christmas Show with Lynda + Susan, arguing who is in control.
At least one Ambridge tradition can occur - the Christmas lights around The Green, which can be done socially distanced.
It is not even October, why oh why, am I thinking ahead to December..Sorry 🎅
Lanjan - September 29, 2020 at 8:20 PM
I presume Alice is paying privately to see the Counsellor .
If so I presume she is paying by the hour and will not be having appointments that often.
By the time the Counsellor has realised why Alice is so worried it may be too late for her to have an abortion anyway.
I agree with Basia she would be far better speaking to a midwife(where is Amy?) or better still go to see her Doctor
Anneveggie - September 29, 2020 at 11:01 PM
If Alice would only confess to Chris, they could then both go to the midwife or doctor and find out exactly what the risk to the foetus is.
I agree with everyone that the actress playing Alice is doing a good job.
That's a very clever heading Gary.
ReplyDeleteThank you Janice!
Delete👍
DeleteGG Another brilliant and topical heading.
ReplyDeleteThank-you, and it means a lot, well to me, anyway.
Warning. Warning.
ReplyDeleteIt’s EE’s style comment.
I was under the impression that Alice was consulting with a counsellor from an abortion clinic. Didn’t the counsellor make some remark about decision making?
When Pip was pregnant didn’t reluctant Tobe or not Tobe suggest an abortion and it was eventually Tobe a baby called Rosie.
Now we have the reverse, an eager I must have a baby, gushing emotional dimwit Chris. And a will she won’t she Alice, have a termination.
My recommendation to Alice would be! consider your circumstances, both physically and emotionally and get back to the counsellor PRONTO.
If you decide to have a termination then there can’t be much time left.
In this circumstance and moment in TA, I am against an abortion, well at the moment.
DeleteAlice might not yet feel ready to be pregnant, but Chris is enthusiatic.
It is not known yet, how far Alice is in her pregnancy and if the "babe" is affected.
I would like to know more, before thinking whether an abortion is the right path to choose.
Alice is panicking and in a mindless whirl, but she might adapt to a baby, as it is already a "fait accompli".
Chris is not listening or even taking any notice of Alice’s difficulties in many aspects of her life and behaviour. He lives in some sort of romantic haze and simply can’t recognise the changes in her behaviour.
DeleteYes, she can discuss the pregnancy but in the end it it her right to choose.
If he is so desperate for a baby he do it The Adam method.
If Chris is such a "dimwit", then how has he his own forge, the farrier work and the extra work of bespoke and individual iron crafts.
DeleteHe has to do his accounts, pay his taxes, etc. Hardly the life of a dimwit.
At least, whatever Alice + Chris decide jointly, after having a scan which has not been mentioned yet, Alice has the offer of a part-time job share with Adam.
ReplyDeleteJoint child-care with Xander?
I have had my say..😣
As I said before my feeling is that Alice will keep the baby but the decision will be taken out of her hands, it'll be too late to terminate and she'll spend her pregnancy fretting on her own. Someone said she forgot to take the pill because of drink, so not a planned pregnancy. She is unable to identify her feelings to herself let alone anyone else. No wonder she feels crowded by flies.
ReplyDeleteDrinks red wine for the iron content, she only cares about herself, bloody alcoholic!
DeleteAlice is not the only stupid woman.
ReplyDeleteIn future I will check to see if that dreadful stop start -er- when talking ,woman with the most ridiculous laugh is going to be on the programme and I will not listen.
I thought I did not like the character of Lilian just because of the bad acting * but now I realise it is also because she is irresponsibly stupid as well.
* in my opinion.
I agree, one stupid young woman seeking advice from another stupid old woman.
DeleteAlice knew that Lilian would tell her what she wanted to hear and that was enough to quash her concerns with alcohol.
Lilian was good with Lynda and Robert, remember..,Didn’t laugh and spoke naturally. Brought about a good result. I agree not a brilliant actor.
DeleteLanJan I'm with you all the way as far as Lilian is concerned.
ReplyDeleteShe has the most disgusting cackle on top of being a very silly, and frequently irresponsible woman.
And she is old enough to know better.
Lilian is kind. That’s a very underrated virtue. Imo, it completely cancels out the cackle.
DeleteI would much rather have Lilian as a friend than most of the other villagers.
DeleteI thought Lillian was doing ok until the 🍷 issue even then she said maybe you should check Kate and of course does not know Alice has become alcohol dependent. It maybe a case of her losing their baby ie through falling when drunk and then she will be devastated and realise that she did want it after all and is then told no more will be possible.
DeleteWhat a lot they currently are Pip, Kate and Fallon and evening Adam not one of them straight forward on the parent front. Why can’t just one couple get pregnant both be over the moon and enjoy their pending parenthood. Yes I know it wouldn’t be much of a SL
but plenty of doom and gloom to even it out I’m sure 🤣
What a joy to see 14 names in the cast list this week 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Oops Kate should read Alice of course!!!!!
DeleteSo obviously whatever the hospital said to Alice, it wasn't enough to bring home the reality of her drinking! As the medical books say there is no safe level of alcohol during pregnancy! As Alice doesn't realise she is an alcoholic she will carry on regardless and then demand answers when they discover the baby is brain damaged and looks different.
ReplyDeleteLilian is hardly the best role model for motherhood, or anything else come to that. Pity, she was such a nice young girl!
Actually, Lilian is a successful business woman.
ReplyDeletePerhaps but don't forget she has got all her money from marrying or living with very rich men! She did have the sense though not to let Justin 'take over' Amside residentials or whatever the official title is!
DeleteWhat’s the betting Freddy makes a mess of directing the village show and Lynda comes to the rescue?
ReplyDeletePretty high I should think. The more she protests she is NOT going to produce another Christmas show, the more certain I become that she will! 🎄
DeleteI agree that Chris is not a ‘dimwit’ when it comes to his work life, having qualified to become a farrier and built up his own successful business. (And become his mother’s pride and joy!)
ReplyDeleteBut he is definitely a dimwit when it come to Alice and personal relations. As I said once before, he just doesn’t have any empathy, can’t ‘read’ her at all. He is so besotted with her that he can’t see beyond the fact he’s going to be a father and possibly, worst of all, just doesn’t listen to what she is trying to tell him. He needs to be able to read between the lines where Alice is concerned.
And as for Lilian and her very outdated view of what you can and can’t do when pregnant - words fail me.
She may be kindhearted, have been a good friend Lynda and is ‘only trying to help’ but she is just about the most irritating character in TA for me, and like Lanjan, I feel like switching off when she is in the day’s cast list.
It’s that dirty, suggestive laugh. And the fact that she sounds permanently semi-drunk!
Whatever we think of Lilian, she did leave Alice feeling a bit more positive about her pregnancy. Modern thinking is no drinking during pregnancy but an occasional one IMHO does no harm. The danger for Alice though is that if she is an alcoholic as it seems, it won’t stop at one drink. We shall see!
ReplyDeleteWhen Alice told Chris, he did ask how she felt about it so not quite as dim as thought. The trouble is that he has Alice up on a pedestal and in his eyes she can do no wrong.
Emma spelt it out loud for them "alcoholic" but neither took a blind bit of notice! So they are both dim. As for Lilian, I Iike her and her acting and she is stupid.
ReplyDeleteLilian was kind to Matt, I know it's morally debatable but I might have done the same.
DeleteAlice is only feeling more positive about her pregnancy because Lilian told her it was okay to drink!
ReplyDeleteI suspect the hospital told her 'No drink' and she had apparently taken notice of that.
The other thing that Lilian said was that she could still have a good time after the baby is born. Alice's idea of a good time is to party and get drunk. That's alright for someone like Lilian who had a live-in nanny for James but the Carters finances won't run to that!
Ordinary people, who can't afford a full time nanny, find that a child makes a profound difference to their lives!
She who cackles has set the door ajar for Alice to feel justified in taking a wee drink now and again.... and again ...and again......
ReplyDelete✅✅
DeleteSuccinctly put Pierre !
ReplyDeleteAnd little doubt that that is what we are about to hear in the coming months.
Succinctly put Pierre !
ReplyDeleteAnd little doubt that that is what we are about to hear in the coming months.
If Alice now believes it is OK for her to continue drinking then we will face a s/l about alcohol syndrome babies. It's hard to see any other outcome unless someone, maybe Emma, makes sure Alice does not drink throughout her pregnancy. Lilian is using outdated information and is an old soak anyway and probably could never imagine surviving without alcohol.
ReplyDeleteWell we can't have Alice having a perfect baby or everyone will think that it is fine to drink as much alcohol as one likes when pregnant.
ReplyDeleteTwo alternatives are that she decides to have an abortion or sadly the baby is born malformed in some way.
In fairness I can't see the latter happening.
I hope not anyway.
Lilian, Chris,Emma would all feel so guilty.
Alice would be suicidal.
Do we want that?
I don't.
I think the only answer is for her to have a miscarriage .
Sad but better than other alternatives.
Why can't we have a nice little storyline where pleasant things happen ?
I suspect she will have a miscarriage as soon as she comes to accept the idea of having a baby. However that is repeating Kirsty's story of a couple of years ago!
DeleteOR she continues with the pregnancy and despite everything the baby is fine. But this means another 6-8 months of this angst. Will there be any listeners left then?
As you say that is not helpful advice (to drink, drink, drink) if the SWs want to follow this issue!
Lilian is a terrible influence on young people. Look at what a horror she has raised in James! Not a very nice person at all.
Thinking further about it, Spicy is right and Alice as she is will make a rubbish mother. She needs time if she is to mature and grow into her present age which must be about 32! Like Pip though she does have family around to palm the baby off on while she goes clubbing or does her own thing! Yes, agree the best outcome would be a miscarriage. The other scenario, maybe abortion without telling Chris and then he may wake up to the fact that she has feet of clay! I’m sorry, but I quite like Lilian!😉
DeleteI actually like Lilian. She is a character, can be very kind-hearted, astute but as an advisor on Alice's pregnancy, she doesn't know the facts. If she did, would she have done what she did?
ReplyDeleteAs for the "cackle" isn't it better to laugh than cry?
Don't forget Gavin, he knows that Alice drinks, he found her when she passed out and shouldn't be fooled into thinking that it was a one off. Will he influence her or insinuate to Chris? Gavin has acquired a lot of life's experience all of a sudden.
ReplyDeleteHe has secrets being kept well hidden, which he would not like to me made public. On that basis only, will he tell about Alice's demise, which is her secret..and both involve others, such as Chris + "babe", plus the workers, particularly Blake.
DeleteMiriam. “Alice’s demise”?
DeleteDo you and Gavin know something we don’t?
Well, now that Lillian has given her permission to drink and have a good,
she and said baby might just head for oblivion.
Is the S/L going to be Alice dead and Chris left holding a damaged baby?
Quite frankly my dear, I don’t give a hoot.
Alice's demise, well to my humble mind, is her love of alcohol.
DeleteI have my thoughts + ideas, as you do, but these obviously differ.
Still we can still post our own individual thoughts + ideas, in a civil way - thanks to Gary G.
It is interesting, reading so many abs varied, differing interpretations of The Archers. We all listen and hear, to suit us.😂
I laughed, with a slight Lillian type of cackle, with the comment:-
Delete"Quite frankly my dear, I don't give a hoot" 🤣
Hee, hee ! A horribly plausible SL, Stasia, but TA don't often let the young die young, do they, except by a terrible accident ? ?They've let this alcohol issue drag on for at least 2 years, as in real life, indeed, they often do, so they ain't going to wind it up with a hastily contrived death, be it mother or foetus or both.
DeleteConfession : haven't been listening at all, but going by comments here a) am glad Lynda has reverted to the ridiculously pretentious & bossy character we liked to dislike, so we don't feel so drawn to feel sorry for her any more b) am glad to miss out on Alice's decline into a car crash, whilst family & husband look on in gormless puzzlement.
What I want to know is what happened to the scratch card found by Daisy which Johnny had lost.
ReplyDeleteWhat I want to know is how young Jack is developing, also his half brother Henry, plus their some-sort-of-cousin Rosie.....
ReplyDeleteThey're third cousins.
DeleteI wonder if we haven't been given a long piece of string by the SWs.
ReplyDeleteI picked up a clue from this evenings episode that perhaps the real story line is going to be the social phenomenon of young woman not wanting to have children at all, and the consequence being a falling birth rate.
Alice has been adamant over the years that she was not ready to have a baby and is now struggling with her emotions because she is pregnant and her perception that she will lose her autonomy.
Fallon this evening has now told her mother that she does not want children, and now understands that she needs, quite rightly to discuss this with her partner.
Alice of course has never discussed the subject with Christopher because Alice has a number of problems connected to understanding the concept of truth.
She lies !
And of course she has been and still is lying to herself.
Fallon being a person of integrity has thought it through.
But could it be a ' theme' ?
I wondered that too MrsP. Have they (the TA team) decided to take on a global issue?It seems strange that after babies galore, possibly one every year, suddenly we have two women, two nights running, declaring they did not/do not want any children. One because she is afraid that a baby will divert attention away from her and one saying it is for the good of the planet!
DeleteSo, two of us with the same thought.
ReplyDeleteAnyone else ?
Yes, me too. I thought of Spike Milligan years ago, saying how much he regretted having children - he loved them but it was bad for the planet. He was an environmentalist before the word was invented. I agree that our planet needs fewer humans. David Attenborough has said that we have over-run the planet, so I believe that a falling birth-rate is a Very Good Thing.
ReplyDeleteI don’t welcome this as a storyline but have to say I sympathise with any woman who doesn’t want children (and there are more of us than you might imagine). I have always been thankful that I live in an age when it is not incumbent on a woman to have children and the means to avoid having them exists. I have never understood why not wanting children for oneself is called ‘selfish’ but wanting children for oneself isn’t.
ReplyDeleteIn terms of TA, both women should have levelled with their partners beforehand. And if. this is partly about out overcrowded and endangered planet, maybe the scriptwriters saw the Old Vic’s recent Zoom performance of Lungs, in which Netflix stars in The Crown, Matt Smith and Clare Foy, starred as a young couple agonising over having children for precisely that reason.
PS The reason I don’t welcome this as a storyline is because I don’t trust the TA scriptwriters not to mess up.
DeleteQuite agree, Maryellen. Women should never be pressured into having children. It has to be an individual choice.
DeleteWell if the reason for taking on this story line is to make us aware that the planet is overloaded with people then they have chosen the wrong programme to do it.
ReplyDeleteI would imagine that most of the listeners are past childbearing age..
To be fair, LanJan that would rule out most of TA’s storylines in that the majority of listeners are not (and possibly never were) in the same position as the characters involved - but it doesn’t stop them being interested in other people’s dilemmas.
DeleteIt may be that they're raising a global issue of interest to all.
DeleteExactly!
DeleteChris, Jacob and Harrison all want babies.
ReplyDeleteMaybe they could all request womb transplants?
I suspect they will all be given one by said partners, Who will promptly forget and just like Toby become the wonder parent of the year.
Although I don’t know where Jacob will get his now that Kate is infertile.
Kate has entered the perimenopause where , unlikely though it is, she can still become pregnant.
ReplyDeleteDo you think TA is doing it’s bit to tie in with David Attenborough’s campaign to save the Planet, which is receiving much air time this week?
ReplyDeleteI am not sure that I agree with you on that one Maryellen .9:22am.
ReplyDeleteListeners may or may not be interested in other people's dilemmas and if they are then there are programmes about those subjects.
I don't think it is the job of the editor of The Archers to make us aware of various problems from which folk may be suffering .
Let us have a bit of escapism
We do get the escapism, mostly the Snells now Lilian has sorted their marriage problem for them, you could hardly call them true to life! But the Archers was never meant to be a fairy tale, and is never more respected than when it handles real life themes well.
DeleteDid the couples not discuss whether or not they wanted children before marriage? I think if a man wants children, and would make a good father, and the woman decides after marriage she doesn't then that isn't being fair on the man, and she should offer him a divorce so that he can marry someone else. That works both ways of course.
ReplyDeleteI know someone who married a man who said before marriage he didn't want children, and she has endured much anguish down the years because she very much wanted a child, but fair dos to him he did make that clear before marriage.
Why the heck she didn't just accidentally on purpose forget to take the pill I don't know. I think a child brings its love with it, and personally I think there is nothing more wonderful than creating a new life.
DeleteRe. Fallon : if thinking intelligent people decide not to have children then the world will end up being filled with, no doubt nice but, unintelligent people who won't have the ability to solve the world's problems.
Can't see that any of the intelligent minus/plus nice, or nice minus/plus intelligent people, ihave made any headway in solving the world's problems thus far !
DeleteMaryellen,I thought that Lilian had no right to try to sort out Lynda and Robert's marital problems .
DeleteThey would have got them sorted out without her in time..Interfering old biddy.
Why on earth did we all need to know about it anyway?
Before we married, Mike said he didn’t want more children already having two from his first marriage. In due course he saw it wasn’t fair on me especially as the two stepdaughters came to live with us. We had Katy and then when she was 3, I felt strongly that I wanted another child. He was adamant that as far as he was concerned that was it. Yes, I thought of accidentally on purpose forgetting the pill but I had to think that he would have resented it and his relationship with the child and with me would have suffered. I think that if he had continued not to want another child, I would very regretfully have walked away as again I could foresee the problems Janice’s friend had to suffer. I agree with Jolene that the urge to become a grandmother is low on the list of priorities when compared with the happiness of her daughter.
Delete....if he had continued not to want another child before we married in addition to the two he had! I accepted the pre marriage agreement that a fourth was not on the cards in due course but it wasn’t easy! No regrets now.
DeleteI can’t agree with you on any of those points, LanJan, so I’ll leave it.
DeleteIt doesn't seem to me that the choice on whether or not to have children is a matter of right or wrong intrinsically
ReplyDeleteI do find it mildly irritating that Fallon has to be given an altruistic reason for not wanting to have a child. So PC, so TA. What about couples who don't have children because it doesn't fit with how they live their lives ? Absolutely & categorically nothing wrong about that ! Just a mature & realistic decision. I've known a number of people like that, & very well rounded people they are ( who don't, incidently, dislike children at all, in fact, enjoy being aunts, uncles, real or surrogate, to others' children)
On the other hand, there is something dodgy about those who see parenthood as some kind of 'right'. Thinking of Helen, of course, who, without a partner, chose to have Henry by means of donor sperm, with no consideration of how a person born that way might have problems, perhaps as a child, & more than likely, as an adult
Well said Carolyn.
ReplyDeleteRecent research concludes that donor children/adults have similar health and well-being to the general population, so Henry should be okay on that account. Helen was probably advised that was the case.
DeleteBefore we married Mr S appeared to agree to my request that there should be no children - other members of my family had done a more than adequate job of going forth and multiplying and I had been helping to bring up children from the age of 10. Unfortunately I had married an arch goal-post mover, and after the first year he said he assumed I didn't really mean it and it was my duty as his wife to have children.
ReplyDeleteHowever, once I had complied he didn't seem all that keen on the result and the upshot is that as his widow I have a son and daughter in their forties dedicated to my well being!
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteAll's well that ends well. I'm glad for you Sarnia.
DeleteFreddie is going to direct the Christmas show? Did he obtain his thespian 🎭 experience whilst enjoying doing time at Her Majesty’s leisure.
ReplyDeleteThen we have the stupid naughty milkman delivering alcohol to ??. Don’t normal people go to the supermarket or off licence. Perhaps a specialist wine seller. I’ll bet Lillian and Justin don’t drink The Bulls plonk.
Fallon doesn’t want babies, so what. It’s her body, her choice. Her disinclination to procreate isn’t about saving the world.
Is she intelligent? How do we know? She married a wooden sounding top so what does that say about her intelligent decision making.
It is all rubbish what about the unsolved stories?
I left out all the question marks. Perhaps I intended them to be rhetorical.
DeleteIn my view, Fallon + Harrison, are the ideal couple, to have a new Ambridge "Babe", born to loving parents, with no hang-ups.
ReplyDeleteThe latest sprogs:- Rosie from a quick liasion between Pip + Toby, Xander a surrogate babe, Jack from a "rape", all of whom are well loved regardless, and now there is Alice and her conditions and quandrary, abortion or not?
I just wish for a normal pregnancy, from a lovely Ambridge couple.
Who was the last - Keira??
...or was it Poppy??
DeleteWhen I was young I did not want to have children.
ReplyDeleteI didn't want to get married either.
I did want to choose how I lived my life alone.
I became pregnant, even though taking precautions available at the time and had an abortion.
Some years later when in a relationship I became pregnant again and unwilling to have another abortion I married and in due course had two daughters.
Circumstances were such that my life as a wife and mother lasted for one single decade.
I realise that the above scenario is not the case for all, but here fifty odd years later I still wish that I could go back and do it all again and stick to my wish and not have children, or to be married.
I did feel as Fallon has claimed that the world is overpopulated and still feel the same, but that was not my only reason. I did not want to be encumbered by children, and in my case I do know that having made the choice to go ahead and have children and to do so willingly, with good will and intention to give it 100%, and having done so, I still feel that I would have gone without.
Motherhood was good and I enjoyed it, but it lasted a very short time for me.
And no, I do not feel it has been worth it.
I agree wholeheartedly with Carolyn, it is a matter of choice to have or not have children with no right or wrong attached to that choice.
But to those who feel it is a ' right' and not a privilege I give no sympathy, and still view IVF and all that science has allowed since to be fundamentally wrong.
Sadly some couples, desparate for a child, cannot conceive naturally. I have no objection to IVF but I am against abortion, unless there is a necessary medical intervention.
DeleteAn unwanted child, which is then given up and then adopted, would fill the void, felt by so many couples.
An old- fashioned view perhaps, but it is still relevant today, for many.
As I have said before, these are just my own thoughts + ideals, which are different from others, I know.
Unwanted children are not always given up for adoption, Miriam. Many, if not most, are left to be brought up by resentful mothers who have no interest in them. I know, I've taught some of them, for whose well-being it might have been better had they never been born.
DeleteI have not joined in this discussion so far as I have little new to add. When I married we assumed we would have children and were blessed with a daughter and son. I enjoyed being a stay at home Mum far more than I would have been pursuing a career.
ReplyDeletePerhaps it was my Jewish upbringing that places such high importance on family and I wanted to be as good a mother to my children as mine had been to me. I hope I succeeded.
But I don’t think it is a ‘right’ for a woman to have a child. I am ambivalent about IVF for happily married couples, but I very much disagree with the course taken by Helen. Deliberately bringing a child into the world without a father present seems like a very self-indulgent act. Sorry if this upsets anyone, but I am still old-fashioned enough to think that a child thrives best with, ideally, a mother and father present in their lives.
I think a couple should talk this important matter over - whether or not to have children - well before marriage. It is the most important decision one can make after all. You can get out of a marriage but you can't get out of parenthood and it is lifelong. Deciding not to procreate is a valid choice and should not be called 'selfish'. It is not selfish as our planet is over-populated. Certainly no-one should put pressure on anyone to provide grandchildren, that IMHO is selfish.
ReplyDeleteI knew a woman for a few years who told me that she married and had children in order to become a grandmother.
ReplyDeleteI thought that very strange indeed.
At the time I knew her she wasn't yet a grandmother.
Caroline 1.55. I think science has made some headway, albeit slowly. A lot of diseases have been wiped out by medicines, think antibiotics, plus the provision of clean water supplies, women no longer have to exhaust themselves having 14 plus children because effective contraception is now available, people like Elon Musk are throwing their energy into space travel and colonisation ( which I think will have to happen if we are to survive in the long term). So I do think intelligent thinking people are making progress and are essential to our longterm progress.
ReplyDeleteI think there is a problem in that these things are not shared out equally around the world. My son was puzzled to see far more people in the Philippines with missing limbs than in Britain, and has realised that this is often because people do not have access to/cannot afford diabetic medication.
You are right Janice. I believe diabetes is almost endemic in some of the Pacific Islands (Figi, Tonga for example) mainly because if the sugar-laden food parcels that were gifted to them from the USA during or after the last war. They have become addicted to high sugar foods. It is almost unusual NOT to have the condition and it’s side effects on some islands.
DeleteBut, I digress, and this has nothing to do with TA.....apologies
Archerphile. I don’t wish to be a killjoy but you are right all this talk of babies wanted or unwanted has deviated from the Archers S/L.
DeletePerhaps the conversation would, as you suggest be moved to the other blog.
Thanks.
Apologies. Take out would and insert could.
DeleteI am looking forward to tomorrows omnibus edition of TA.
ReplyDeleteI enjoy the continuity and picking up on salient points, I missed in the weekly, nightly, episodes. There are always quite a few!
It will be listening to TA at 10.00am with extreme interest, whilst cleaning the kitchen, where I am now making a mess, cooking R.Lamb and all the extras.
DeleteTA will help me take my mind off this chore. 😆
I wonder if they are planning a long term story about Foetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder? As I'm sure I'm sure the issue of early developmental trauma will crop up again in the future as Helen's oldest (whose name I've forgotten!) moves up through school and struggles to cope socially. He's already seen as a little bit difficult, isn't he?
ReplyDeleteFASD is a life long disability which generally isn't visible. The physical symptoms are apparently only apparent if the mother is drinking on days 19, 20 and 21 of the pregnancy. Brain development effects aren't visible. A reluctant mum who is drinking regularly and sometimes binging, but holding down a job pretty much ok, and a child with a compromised ability to manage decision-making and impulse control doesn't bode well. Nut lots of good story lines!
Interesting information regarding FASD Jules, I don’t think we’ve been told yet how many weeks along she is, since it was the result of forgetting to take her contraceptive pill she probably doesn’t know either. The physical symptoms are relatively subtle so presumably would not be easily spotted on an early scan, although careful measurement might show some abnormality if the mother expressed concerns. We certainly know that Alice was was drinking pretty heavily.
ReplyDeleteI am also intrigued as to how pregnant Alice is. She doesn't seem to be in a rush, about booking in with her GP. and a midwife, to arrange her care + book scans.
DeleteKP I think if it was me, I would write your last sentence as:-
"drinking very heavily"... 😁
So Alice now thinks that drinking red wine, will boost her iron levels - thanks to Lilian!
ReplyDeleteSadly it is the opposite..red wine can prevent the absorption of iron, from a normal diet.
Lilian's advice was so out-of-date and will do no good for Alice, IMHO, but could be wrong.
I know many do not like me guessing future S/Ls, but I just have to do this one.
DeleteIt is Alice drinks too much, yet again, has an "accident" of some sort, rushed to hospital but all is OK. This is when she realises, that she does want her baby...so it ends up, as the fairy tales say - Happily Ever After - and Baby Carter arrives safely, sometime in 2021.
Miriam. I call that wish, living in hope, waiting in vain.
DeleteThe Ambridge Fairy will hopefully, have an input 🤞🤞 😂
DeleteThank you JULES for the further information on FASD.
ReplyDeleteWe have wondered earlier in this thread or on the last blog whether or not this was the intention of TA.
It's good to have the understanding and details that you have provided.
Perhaps you are a doctor ?
The effects of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome vary from one child to another. There can be some physical repercussions but they are mainly behavioural and psychological. These children have poor attention and short ability to concentrate. Many of the behavioural aspects are similar to those described in autism. It is a syndrome, so some children might have severe debilitating affects and others very little.
ReplyDeleteThe current medical thinking is for a pregnant woman to abstain during the pregnancy, however the evidence on what might be a safe amount to consume is not there. Hence the advice is don’t drink. Alice doesn’t know the time frame for getting pregnant. We know it is at least a few weeks.
She only knows because of the hospital test. Many women may drink alcohol up to the point of a positive test and stop. If she accepts Lillian’s advice then she could be putting the foetus at risk.
Please will somebody fill me in about this scratch card?
ReplyDeleteHow come Fallon had Johnnie's card but has now lost it.?
Thank you.
Johnny bought some because Joy told him he'd get lucky and then inadvertently threw them in the bin on the Green and realised too late he might have won. Daisy, Harrison's niece found one, Fallon wanted to keep it but he was going to advertise in the shop. Now it's lost again...
DeleteI said I wanted to know what happened to the scratch card and it wasn't forgotten, I reckon it'll still turn up. Jill and Ben had this conversation before, when he made it home after his 18th night out. She said that she went out for cream tea but his experience was somewhat different. I certainly don't want surprises, even though I'm younger than Jill, too many in the last 15 years. When young we make things happen and then it's a case of be careful what you wish for.
ReplyDeleteThey keep repeating before each episode that it was recorded before the current restrictions which are?
- the latest ones, the rules of 6 from one household together and no more than 15 at an outside event, so I think. It is confusing though.
DeleteI think Jill repeating the same story to the same listener is characteristic of old people.
DeleteWatch it Maryellen! There are quite a few ‘old people’ contributing to this blog! 😉
DeleteFantastic! It’s the TA storyline I’ve always wanted! Buried treasure, archeologicalists uncover an important archeological site, putting Ambridge on the world archeology map and drawing so many visitors, they have to create a visitor’s centre an museum, where Lynda is in her element. Fallon enlarges her catering business. Most importantly, it brings in new and interesting characters.🙂
ReplyDeleteOr it might just be a handful of Victorian pennies, dropped from some old Archer’s pocket.🙁
or fell from Phil's pocket.
DeleteI remember you suggesting this storyline a long time ago Maryellen. I think it was when there were a lot of archaeological digs on television and it was a very popular interest. I think I also suggested that they could invite Carenza Lewis to make an appearance as a famous expert to come and investigate what had been found in Ambridge.
DeleteMaybe, at long last, your excellent suggestion is going to come to pass!
Lovely scenario Maryellen and straight from the fifties, where of course TA started.
ReplyDeleteI was very confused by this evenings episode.
Thank you Basia, I thought it was me having deja vu on hearing of the eighteenth birthday cream tea.
And the conversation between Alice and Fallon seemed bizarre given Alice's recent confusion extended over what felt like three weeks of episodes. Now she appears to have accepted that she is to have a baby and seemed to me to be pretending that she and Chris had discussed and decided together.
It didn't seem to me to be a seamless blend in the process of acceptance, if that is what we are supposed to understand it is.
What happened in between these two scenarios ?
Nevertheless Alice does seem to have accepted the no alcohol rule.
ReplyDeleteBetter late than never ?
If she was so dependant on alcohol up until her ‘accident’ it’s not going to be that easy to just give up, is it? Wouldn’t she be getting some sort of withdrawal symptoms if she has suddenly stopped drinking? This is a genuine question because I have no experience of alcoholism or what happens when someone is trying to stop.
DeleteAs an original member of the ‘Jill Fan Club’ I was relieved to hear her again last night, for the first time since lockdown began.
ReplyDeleteBut even I have to say, her acting came over as a bit desperate. Rushed, too much emphasis on the wrong words, not very natural at all.
Well done Paddy Greene for making the effort, but she probably finds it difficult to cope reading the script with her eye problem and having to act at sitting 2 metres away from the other actors.
I very much regret to say, perhaps it is time for Jill to retire to a distant cottage with her Leonard and let the younger generation have full reign at Brookfield.
Perhaps the same goes for Peggy?
I was hoping to hear of Jill but not Jill herself because I find her trying to listen to. I agree the actor should take the current situation as a hint it’s time to retire and leave the airwaves to younger actors more in need of the work. And Yes, the same goes for the other older actors.
DeleteI still think Jill sounded more natural than Ben/Josh not sure which! Very wooden 'script-reading' by the young man.
DeleteI don't necessarily think that the younger actors are more "in the need of the work" though. Even though Paddy Greene is 89 and will be getting a pension I don't suppose she has accumulated great wealth as an actor. Certainly not from BBC radio! Add to that the fact she is is only paid on the scripts in which she takes part, there is no 'central contract.'
TA did have some archaeology finds some years ago if I remember correctly. Something to do with the Civil War as there was supposed to have been a battlefield in the area.
And of course the 'Drummer Boy' ghost at The Bull was I think connected to the Civil War too.
My book says there are Bronze Age burial mounds on Lakey Hill and evidence of a Bronze Age settlement at Long Ground, a field near Hollowtree Pig Unit, also of a Roman farmstead at Jiggins Field which was partly excavated in the mid-70s.
DeleteI have seen references to the Jill actor’s big house, which suggests she is not on the breadline, while the Kirsty actor is bringing up a family in a 2 bedroom flat. The severe lack of work makes this a tough time for actors in mid career- time for those at the end of theirs (past it, in some cases) to do the decent thing.
I agree with you about Jill ,Archerphile and Maryellen.
ReplyDeleteI don't know where Leonard lives but think she should go and move in with him and be heard about but not actually heard as you say Maryellen.
I still don't know why they can't get Carole to go and live with her daughter so that Jill can sell her cottage or why they don't get Kathy to move to be with Jamie.
I bet the present script writers haven't a clue who Jamie is anyway.
Idon't agree about Peggy though
I think the actress playing her is still good .
I agree with you ,Spicycushion that Ben sounded wooden.
ReplyDeleteI have only just started to listen again (I am doing the washing up now - at 2pm and 7pm )
I won't be listening again to last night's episode when I wash up after lunch today.
Whether an actor stays or leaves should be entirely on merit and not according to their financial situation. No one has become rich from the Archers.
ReplyDeleteI think there’s more than merit affecting an actor’s employability - reliability, flexibility, availability etc. The arbiters there would be the casting director and the actor’ agent. Whether the actors themselves need the job for financial reasons or want the job for professional self esteem is an individual thing.
DeleteMaryellen - I really like your s/l suggestions. This would be an upbeat s/l which is much needed with all the financial doom and gloom going on. Plus the 'joys' of hearing about alcohol abuse and human beings called 'horses' etc. Let's have some escapist pleasure.
ReplyDeleteWhat I couldn't fathom out last night, was the missing scratch card and it's sudden relevance.
ReplyDeleteI liked hearing Jill again, but I thought she was recording remotely and not in the studio. I also think that Carole T should up and leave Glebe Cottage, which Jill could sell.
It would "snapped up" by new Ambridge residents, which the Hills certainly, aren't!
To add - I don't think Jill will ever move out of Brookfield, nor will she ever marry Leonard. They are just companions, enjoying very many times together, being so like minded.
DeleteI’m standing up for Carol who I like a lot. Why should she have to move out of Glebe Cottage just to suit the whims of listeners who don’t even live in Ambridge? Jill doesn’t want to leave Brookfield and clearly doesn’t need to sell, she’s okay with the income from the rent and enjoys having her long time friend there. It’s not for us to interfere!
DeleteThe characters in T A are frequently silenced, so there should no problem putting Jill back into her box. Ben should go away and be a proper student at university. I do hope he is ‘reading’ drama with acting.
ReplyDeleteStasia✔️✔️✔️✔️✔️
DeleteI can understand that old coins may be found using a metal detector but the chance of a couple of them lying on the surface of the field I would think would be pretty remote.
ReplyDeleteI am not going to be listening again but I can't remember whether it was eagle eyed Jill or Ben who noticed them.
Why haven't the burial mounds on Lakey Hill been excavated?
I know when some of us were making up future episodes * mention was made about finding old coins in a field some years ago it was when the Grundy's were on their uppers and we were hoping that it would be Ed who found the treasure.
Whose land were Jill and Ben on?
* The first alternative script I think was written by Ellie May.
It was great .
She had Rob jumping over a fence on his horse and breaking his neck.
What a lot of angst we would have avoided had that happened!
Lanjan. With so many S/ls being dragged out at the moment do we need The Ambridge Hoard? All us oldies might lose the plot or become The Ambridge Bored?
DeleteMiriam is the exception of course. 😉
As I am now an official State Pensioner, I also lose the plot - which is quite often, hence my listening to the TA omnibus on a Sunday, to catch up, on what I missed, nightly. 🤣😂
DeleteWell Stasia,I certainly don't.
DeleteLet us concentrate on Phillip and Gavin.
When Ptb Y and I said that we didn't trust them I think some people thought we were being Welshist .
I can't speak for P tbY but then I don't like Natasha either.!
I am not Welshist though.
I once had a lovely Welsh boyfriend.
LanJan - re the coins, I think the reference to Ruth doing the harrowing is the clue.
DeleteThe scriptwriters are on a sticky wicket now.
ReplyDeleteIf they allow Alice to have a perfectly healthy baby now after the amount of alcohol she has consumed it will send out the message that it is perfectly OK to drink a large amount of alcohol when pregnant.
As I said on an earlier blog I think the only way out for them is for Alice to have a miscarriage.
Alice is trying to persuade herself that if it hasn't happened to other drinking mothers it won't happen to her. I'm still sticking to my prediction that she will go through it but the whole process will be harrowing and she might end up a wreck not the baby which is not in anybody's interest.
ReplyDeleteAt the moment Chris is as bad, for different reasons, as Rob was, when their respective wives became pregnant. Sadly there the similarity ends as Chris and Alice love one another and are still 'in love' I would say. Of course poor Helen (never thought I'd call her that!) was raped by her husband which resulted in an unwanted pregnancy.
ReplyDeleteHowever when the pregnacy was confirmed both men took over, answering the midwife's questions and asserting what the woman has done or not done. I hope that the midwife picked up on Alice's hesitation at times and follows it up.
Now we know that Alice is exactly 12 weeks pregnant she still has a bit of time to change her mind about going ahead with the pregnancy. But like Lanjan I think she will have a miscarriage because of the implications of the message being sent out about alcohol during pregnancy.
The other annoying thing is the fact that the SWs have Alice stopping drinking excessively just like that! If she was drinking as heavily as hinted at and portrayed she would be getting withdrawal symptons. And she was /is an alcoholic; some days drinking vodka at breakfast time! But no she is healthy, well balanced and whose appearance gives no concern to those who see her. Unrealistic I'm afraid!
My prediction about interesting new characters is already on the way to being fulfilled forget uninspiring Alice, there’s archeology student Evie on the horizon!
ReplyDeleteWhat about the young 26 year old Doctor who fancied the almost18 year old Ben?
ReplyDeleteWhat about her?
DeleteWell Maryellen ,it was a pointless story.
DeleteWhy introduce a new character for one episode.
The storylines have not been good for a while .
ReplyDeleteIs Elizabeth on a dating site or have a imagined that?
I didn't listen except for the first few episodes when the monologues started.
If so,I bet she goes for someone younger.
I wonder if the Alice’s scan will show up some abnormality, not necessarily alcohol related, so she has a “valid” reason to opt for a termination. She and Chris could then decide whether they do want to start a family, and if so Alice will have the opportunity to get help with her alcohol addiction prior to trying to conceive a second time. The midwife didn’t really emphasise the point, but the first few weeks of pregnancy are when alcohol is most dangerous, unless a couple are consciously trying to conceive the woman may easily overindulge in that period.
ReplyDeleteIf the midwife did pick up on Alice's hesitation, and even if not, she could, and perhaps should, access Alice's notes from the hospital from the recent ' feint' as Alice called it.
ReplyDeleteIt wasn't a feint, she collapsed. When Gavin found her he picked up the sight of her on the verge with his lights. She must have been there for more than a few seconds.
The hospital notes would also have recorded that Alice high levels of blood alcohol, remember Gavin smelt it on her and the medics would have too.
ReplyDeleteAlice is getting closer to admitting her drinking to Chris, so maybe she can get a grip and sort herself out.
Add to that the hospital told her she was pregnant and probably gave her a telling off so that should all be in her notes!
ReplyDeleteMessage for Ben.
ReplyDeleteThose who can do. Do
Those who can’t do
Teach geography.
There is your future Ben.
😂 BUT I think there is a geography teacher among us , so perhaps there needs to be a quick poetic addition saying that some teachers have a genuine vocation and are truly inspiring.
DeleteI do apologise to our resident geography teacher. I’m sure you are/were excellent.
DeleteOn seconds thoughts he could be the next PM several years down the line. At least one ex PM did geography. Maybe it fits better with politics.
Mea culpa.
KPnuts and Spiceycushion- precisely my point.
ReplyDeleteDidn't think I needed to detail what the notes would have told the midwife.
Anyone who watches Doctors, the lunchtime soap on BBC (or did before Covid stopped filming) might be interested to know that Alice’s midwife is played by one of their actresses.
ReplyDeleteNurse Ayesha, who left the practice at the end of the last series has now swopped to radio to play another nurse/midwife.
I thought her voice was familia last night but couldn’t quite place it.
So for this actress, one for closed and another opened.
I,too, knew the voice but couldn't place it! That's three of the female staff at Letherbridge have briefly appeared in TA; Mrs Tembe (something to do with LoLo for one night only), Ruhma who was Elizabeth's counsellor and now Nurse Ayesha (who I never really took too as she could be very stroppy!) And of course from TA we have had Leonard and Oliver make 'guest' appearances in Doctors!
DeleteBharti Patel who is Rhuma in Doctors, played Anita in the archers. This was the person from the help line, which Helen called. This was on 25/3/2016.
DeleteI have finally found out, who did play Elizabeth's counsellor. It was Lorna Laidlaw, the wonderful Mrs. Tembe. She was called Jamilla and there was a wonderful episode (13/2/2019) which was the face to face, counselling session.
DeleteThe only characters in this episode, were Elizabeth + Jamilla.
I remember it, as being just a wonderful episode, with sad overtones, relating to Nigel.
Spicy, I totally agree with ups about Ayesha, never took to her from her first day. Jolly relived when she left! Wonder when it will be back?
Delete(Sorry, another digression from TA)
I liked Ayesha, for the feisty person she was.
DeleteDidn't Doctors have an episode, relating to a child who had FAS, so highliting it, as TA is now attempting to do.
Think this should also be on the other page.
Ayesha's strength was her ability to sulk for the nation if she couldn't have everything her way!
DeleteBharti Patel played Geraldine the assistant manager at LoLo, who resigned when Elizabeth was letting things slide whilst preoccupied with Freddie's impending court case and imprisonment. As Miriam says she had previously played Anita the woman on the help line that Helen had rung after Rob had confiscated her car keys.
DeleteLorna Laidlaw's appearance as Elizabeth's counsellor came on the same day as her last appearance on Doctors.
Phew! Glad we managed to sort that out in my head. I'm a bit of a pedant I'm afraid! 😁
Archerphile - I wouldn't worry about the occasional slip up about which blog to write a comment. Your previous comment was quite understandable following on as it did about whether to have children or not which was the main story-line last week!
DeleteI have now taken to copying my comments before 'publish' as I keep getting message 'whoops .... ' etc!
I heard on the radio today about a new law to be voted on tomorrow in France to extend the lawful termination from 12 to 14 weeks, then checked that in the UK it's 24.
ReplyDeleteI think it comes partially down to religion. I have to tread carefully here, but the major faith in these two countries are different, which can influence such rulings, such as contraception.
DeleteDid Chis and Alice actually go to see the midwife or was it all done by phone?
ReplyDeleteit wasn't realistic to me either way.
I thought the actress playing the midwife sounded as if she was reading prepared notes.
I understood it to be by zoom or phone, or some such technology.
DeleteHowever I did note that Alice regretted that it wasn't Face to face.
Alice, let me tell you something.
If you had been face to face with the midwife, she would most definitely have picked up the slight give away when you hesitated before you lied about your drinking.
I think the midwife knows, as a result of Alice's hospital visit. Hence the questions re alcohol and the mentioning of constant urine + blood tests.
DeleteI have done a lot of research on Fetal Acohol Syndrome and as expected, the first trimester is the most dangerous period. Alice has only just learnt that she is already 3 months into her pregnancy. In the past 3 months, she was drinking heavily, but hiding it.
I am sure if she tells the truth to both Chris and her midwife, she can get the help she so needs. I hope she has been frightened into doing this.
I realise that this is not the right place, but it is a follow on from previous thoughts. To post on the other board, would be out of place, at this time.
DeleteI have no experience of FAS in my previous work, but I do have experience of new borns, with a problem. This relates to a foster parent, a regular client of mine, who specialised in caring for new babes, born from Mums with a drug problem. These newborns, were born "addicted" and had to go through withdrawal symptoms after the birth. This is where I came in, supplying the needed meds for these, and as a result, I got to see the progress, the care that was needed and how social services helped.
I hope Alice's situation, does not end up in a similar way - but I think not. She has to tell all, now.
All about the money found by chance.
ReplyDeleteI said the scratch card would turn up. It must have been when Fallon was dressing up Jazzer for the photo shoot, now it will find its way back to Johnny.
Miriam- your wish has been granted.
ReplyDeleteThe scratch card makes another appearance.
Is it possible it can get itself lost ....... yet again ?
Miriam that must have been very rewarding to see those addicted babies recover.
ReplyDeleteI do hope that most of them did, although I realise that some must not do so.
Agree that Alice needs to tell all and now. Don't wait a moment longer.
ReplyDeleteThe S/Ws need to see the “bigger picture”. Not just Ruth.
ReplyDeleteNow we have the game of Pass the Scratch Card!
Plus a gaggle of archeology “girls” shipped in to satisfy testosterone fuelled Ambridge ‘boys’.
Perhaps the next S/Ws ‘brain storming’ session, on what next in T A, should include actors who can act.
I predict a new future issue concerning Elizabeth and online romance fraud.
DeleteOoo yes, Stasia. Just been watching an interview on BBC Breakfast with a woman who fell prey to that. Lost over £53,000, her entire savings to an online ‘Romance scammer’
DeleteThe thief pretended be in the Royal Navy and groomed her for months before pleading with money for medical treatment for someone stuck abroad.
Could Elizabeth be duped like that?
A possibility?
Regarding the new archeology storyline ....I think the SWs have been reading this blog and thought Maryellen's idea was great, and something a bit different to the usual fare.
ReplyDeleteHence introducing the Angolan-Saxon coins and a whole host of possibilities.
Well done, Maryellen. 😊
Katy said the archaeology story was flawed as with Covid restrictions it is not even allowed to put students in a coach together. Professional archaeologists are back at work but obviously having to stick to the social distancing rules. Maybe the wrong time for this SL!
ReplyDeleteThat’s interesting Ev, I did wonder listening to Ben. He would seem to be experiencing student differently to those currently at university. Would a first year, first term student really be able to rustle up an archeological dept at such short notice?
DeleteMary Ellen’s prediction would be a good storyline to project. But I suspect to make it dramatic it will have to involve an issue.
I hope the Grundy will be down there with their metal detector claiming first dabs. Of course they will have to share with David and Ruth and the dept of Antiquities.
Absolutely the right timing for this storyline as far as I’m concerned because I was beginning to feel like LanJan that the other current storylines make dire
Deletelistening. The continuity announcers are careful to point out that the storylines were conceived and recorded BEFORE current Covid-19 restrictions were in place. I have every confidence that Felmersham University will do the right thing by its students and their contacts.
Correction.
DeleteStudent life. The Grundy’s.
Didn’t Ruth say that Eddie had been in that field with his metal doctor and found nothing. So presumably he was given permission at some point to explore?
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteApologies to any residents of Felmersham reading my previous post who may be surprised to find they have a university - it should of course read Felpersham!
Deletemaryellen. You will be pleased to know that Felmersham does exist and could possibly have a university! Perhaps of the Third Age, with resident archaeologists.
DeleteHaving been on dig myself it was the official county archaeologists who conducted the exploration. They were persuaded by a farmer that the land had bee a roman site. They did find Anglo Saxon bits and pieces.
Of course the news will leak, as things do in Ambridge and the hoard may well be robbed. A job for the local Sargent.
My imagination is doing overtime.
Apologies.
I think Miriam may have transmitted some brain waves to me.
Delete🤣🤣🤣
DeleteMy imagination does go overboard at times.
I am trying to reign this in, re The Archers and future S/L's.
I am intrigued, as you all know, about the scratch card, which has now turned up in Jazzer's washing! Who can now prove who owns it....
ReplyDeleteEnter Sgt. Burns - his big case, at last, to solve.
This is better than a game of "Cludeo", which I love and always win, so much so that no-one will play it with me. 😢
At least Jazzers pockets were emptied, before all was going into the wash. I wonder what else was found, but perhaps, that is better not to be known.
DeleteLooking forward to hearing Jennifer dahling this evening.
ReplyDeleteThought it possible we might never hear from her again.
"Far less complicated this time " ............ ?
ReplyDeleteDream on Jennifer.
Another clue ?
or another TA teaser + "red herring"...which often happen.
DeleteFamous last words Jennifer!
ReplyDeleteI was right the scratch card got lost when Fallon dressed up Jazzer for the photo shoot.
I won't rest though until it's in Johnny's hands. Webster might have mangled it!
That's a good point. Is it mangled, so cannot be paid out? That might be a good twist.
DeleteWell thought..
Jennifer said, somethg like, how anxious she was with the Lexi pregnancy, remarking on how well Xander is.
ReplyDeleteShe has no idea what her daughter has been up to..
I just hope her happy tears, will not be reproduced....in any other way.
I thought Susan was very good with Jennifer. I wonder why Alice didn’t text her mother to find out when she would be at home before going to impart the news. Perhaps she doesn’t feel up to it, yet and hasn’t tried.
ReplyDeleteIf Alice had done the outcome wouldn't have been the same.
DeleteMaryellen, I thought Susan made a brilliant job of a very sticky situation with Jennifer.
ReplyDeleteEmollient to the last.
She's a clever cookie is Susan when she thinks her way through a problem
And Jenny perhaps at last coming closer to accepting the fact that she "is related to a Horribin"
Not just related Jennifer, but sharing grandmother responsibilities with a Horribin.
( if your daughter is lucky enough to give birth to a live full term baby )
I agree with others that Susan behaved very well with Jennifer's outburst. She smoothed the waters and made an ally of Jennifer. We can only hope that this s/l will have a happy ending.
ReplyDeleteI remember Susan being equally good with Lynda when she was in a state about something, one of her shows I think, and I’ll never forget the calm and competent way in which - at a moment’s notice and.working against the clock - Susan altered one of Christopher’s jackets to go with Jazzer’s best man’s outfit.
ReplyDeleteSusan also organised Williams's childcare.
ReplyDeleteWhat I thought last night though, was that this was Charlotte Martin in her professional role rather than Susan.